Guest: Dr. Frances (Frankie) Zhu; Topics: We talked about Dr. Zhu's University of Hawaii AI and Robotics Lab, robotic and AI capabilities, terrestrial vs space robots, ethical issues for a permanent lunar hab, robotic ethical issues, the value of robotic idle time, the need for autonomous robots and why plus more.
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Dr. Frankie Zhu joined us from her University of Hawaii AI and Robotics lab to discuss advanced AI and robotics, a permanent lunar habitat presence for humans, autonomous robots and why we need them plus much more. We started our discussion by talking about rover advancements in capabilities, features, durability and more. Her wheel example was one of many such examples used to illustrate the rate progress being made with AI and robots. Several times during our discussion, our guest referred to Boston Dynamics work with robots. Check out their website to see what they have created and are working on: Our guest talked about the use of quadrupeds and bipeds plus the ability to simulate movement, even horses trotting or galloping.
As we moved on with our discussion, we started focusing on robots for space. Several issues came up but one was structural load and movement. She talked about having a robot hop on Earth or on the Moon where it would likely hop six feet or more due to the lower lunar gravity. Also discussed was the hardware (the body of the robot), software and control. Dr. Zhu talked about a learning process in landing on the Moon or Mars. Don't miss what she said about this and the algorithm development side. Being independent of human control has become an increasingly important factor. She explained the reasoning for her perspective, then our guest compared the capability of the new Mars rover Perseverance to the older Curiosity as an example. The important of being autonomous was emphasized, especially later in our discussion when Frankie explained the high cost of idle time for a robot such as waiting for Earth communications to arrive on Mars. Plus the frequent use of the costly Deep Space Network (DSN). Frankie then mentioned she was doing some work with Astrobotic Technology in working to optimize robots for their purpose.
We talked about Artemis and a permanent human base on the Moon needing infrastructure consisting of AI and robots. Frankie then got my attention when she asked for my personal opinion about the ethics of a permanent human lunar base. After recovering from the surprise of being asked for my opinion, I did ramble a bit but answered her question. After you hear this discussion, with my commentary, post your thoughts on this subject on our blog. We want to hear from you. Moving forward with about the second half of the show, ethics played a big part in our discussion, even with robots.
Having earlier heard the news story about a Google employee writing an op-ed about the Google Chatbot being sentient and then being fired, I asked our guest about the possibility of sentient computers. Here is just one media story about the Google incident and their chatbot software: www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/jun/12/google-engineer-ai-bot-sentient-blake-lemoine. In talking about it, Frankie mentioned the Turing Test for determining if a computer was sentient. We took a call from Marshall who brought up the 1974 riveting test for robots. Marshall did not think robots were sentient nor would they be anytime soon. Dr. Zhu added to the discussion with a comment saying that robots lacked their own motivation to do something. This led to a discussion with our guest about ethical issues regarding life and rights nature.
Frankie used more examples to continue the ethics discussion. She brought up the controversy in Hawaii over the building of the Thirty Meter Telescope which if built would be a very big problem for indigenous, Native Hawaiian cultural and spiritual rights. In addition, there appears to have been a serious lack of community and native input plus location concerns for the environmental impact Mauna Kea. Frankie contrasted these cultural and environmental concerns with the quest for progress in science that might prove very beneficial to all of humanity. Let us know what you thought of our discussion and how you see the issues Frankie and I discussed.
Additional topics included doing things to hurt or even destroy a robot. Was that an ethical concern? This part of the discussion was broad ranging. Bill from Tucson is the one who brought up communication delays with robots and the need to be autonomous. Don't miss all of what our guest said in discussing this important issue and concern. What do you think about countering robotic idle time? Near the end of the program, Paul from NY asked about the ethics of using a robot to do dangerous things, maybe even tasks that would destroy the robot. Musk was brought up in the context of pushing the limits and also wanting to be operating in an extreme environment, Mars. This part of the discussion led to the ethical use of animals, probably dogs, to do dangerous things that might kill them. A bomb sniffing dog was mentioned as an example. Once again, share your thoughts with us after you hear what our guest had to say about this and related topics. Before the program ended, I asked our guest about the student interest in her lab and class. As you will hear it was and is very strong.
Please post your comments/questions on our blog for this show. You can reach our guest through me or her University of Hawaii faculty page which you can easily find with a simple Google search.
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