Broadcast 2583

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Guest: Dr. Charles Lurio. Topic: Commercial Space law updates, NASA, SLS, HSF, space leadership plus more. Please direct all comments and questions regarding Space Show programs/guest(s) to the Space Show blog, Comments and questions should be relevant to the specific Space Show program. Written Transcripts of Space Show programs are a violation of our copyright and are not permitted without prior written consent, even if for your own use. We do not permit the commercial use of Space Show programs or any part thereof, nor do we permit editing, YouTube clips, or clips placed on other private channels & websites. Space Show programs can be quoted, but the quote must be cited or referenced using the proper citation format. Contact The Space Show for further information. In addition, please remember that your Amazon purchases can help support The Space Show/OGLF. See For those listening to archives using and rating the programs, please email me as to why you assign a specific rating to the show. This will help me bring better programming to the audience. We welcomed back Dr. Charles Lurio for this comprehensive commercial space update plus Dr. Lurio took a hard look at human spaceflight. During the first segment of our nearly 1 hour 55 minute show, Charles started with the news that broke just before airtime that congress had approved the new commercial space legislation. The House and Senate compromised on the learning period extending it to 2023. Charles hit on some highlights of the bill but said he had not yet had time to read the final version since the news literally broke minutes before air time. Other first segment discussion topics included the return to flight for Falcon 9 and the Cygnus which will launch on an Atlas 5 until Antares has a return to flight sometime early next year. Charles talked about the new Russian rocket motor for Antares and its relationship to other major Russian rocket motors. Next, we talked about the NASA delay for the commercial cargo awards and their letter to Boeing saying that the cargo version of the CST 100 was no longer under consideration. Charles speculated that the delay might have been taken to allow for return to flight for the Falcon and for the Cygnus on the Atlas 5. Paul in NY emailed Charles asking for him to tell us his favorite commercial space company and his favorite NewSpace company. Charles said he loved SpaceX and commented on them moving the ground in the launch industry. He said he has always been a fan of XCOR and gave us some update at to the XCOR progress and challenges, especially in their wing production. Charles also said that the asteroid mining companies, particularly Deep Space Industries, were starting to attract foreign capital as he mentioned investment interest from the Czech Republic. I asked Charles if he was satisfied with the way the industry was developing so far. He said he was amazed with it and what has happened so far, but made the point that commercial space was far from being on easy street. He then explained his comments listing examples to support his comments. I asked him about the NASA Roadmap to Mars and he repeated back to me, you meant the "Jokemap" to Mars? That should provide you with a clue as to the rest of the discussion on this topic. Before the break, Don called from New Hampshire to talk about radiation, Brookhaven, and human spaceflight. Charles and Don talked about shielding, the lack of real quality experiments plus finding out answers to other needed questions for HSF BELO including life support systems, microgravity, plus lots more. Charles concluded that NASA was not serious about space, something many guests have said over and over again in recent years. Don said the system management was shortsighted. Charles said what we needed was a new NACA, not so much NASA. This remained a theme for Charles for the rest of the show. Before ending the call, Don talked about Japanese radiation experiments and equipment that NASA won't use, citing NE213 and a newer version, EJ301. In the second segment, I asked Charles what would be a reasonable set of expectations for our commercial and HSF program given the state of comprehensive matters facing the US and the world at this time in 2015. Charles had some very interesting things to say in response to this question which actually commanded most of the second segment. A subtopic in this discussion was the subject of technology and technology development. Again, don't miss what he said about technology. I asked Charles about the development of cislunar space and the Moon. He would welcome both but listen to all of what he had to say about this because he repeated himself that we were not doing anything. Doug in S. California called in with multiple questions for Charles about what was needed for a flyby to Mars and more. It appeared to me that Doug was not getting what Charles was talking about though Charles kept saying that Doug was not asking the right set of questions. In summary, I think Doug was suggesting technology advancements lowering costs for example, would compel policy makers and the public to support and create the space policy we seem to yearn for when this subject comes up on the show. Charles kept repeating that the technology to be used was not the issue. Instead, the issue was political in that there was no will to do things, no leadership. Since this is something I have ranted about on many Space Show programs, I supported Charles on the leadership issue and I do believe that having the will to do something serious in space and having the leadership to actually get policies in place that can be implemented are much bigger problems than the technology or even the financial side of things. Once the policy and will are there, implementation is next and that is when technology will be looked at and decided upon. See what you think about this discussion with Dr. Doug. Later, on the same subject, Charles said it was very difficult to change society attitudes. Doug Messier emailed in comments that it was easy to rant on NASA but pointed out the slow going of many commercial space projects from suborbital development to rocket development. Doug suggested that had progress been faster, leadership and some of the issues Charles was bringing up would be there and the industry might be different today. Both Charles and I agreed with Doug Messier except the reality on the ground is what has to be dealt with and for which solutions are needed regarding moving the commercial industry and HSF forward. As the show was ending, Charles said development would not and does not follow a predicted path. He also said that it was possible for there to be "moments of great acceleration" that could jump us forward. This subject has not come up in recent years on TSS but it is worth noting that one cannot count on or build project around the hope for serendipity to change something. Great if it happens but no way can one count on or plan on it happening. In the end, Charles and I both said that there is far more leadership awareness today than yesterday. I suggested that from Space Show interviews, lots of bright people were focused on solving this problem and I had faith that it would be solved though I had no idea of a timeline or what the solution would look like. Charles concluded that commercial space and HSF will continue to evolve incrementally over time on an unpredicted path. Please post your comments/questions on TSS blog above. You can reach Dr. Lurio through The Lurio Report at or through me at The Space Show address.



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10 Nov 2015 Dr. Charles Lurio
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